Theos-Talk Archives (May 1996 Message tl00047)

Hello Liesel,

In your message of 29 Apr 1996 19:10:47 -0400
(liesel@dreamscape.com) - you asked:
> And I'm wondering ... does the tenant reside there, or do
>you think the monad is the tenant itself?

I can't say for sure but my understanding to date would say it's
the monad.

>I think, in a way, one can borrow the scientific method to
>investigate non-physical phenomena, dunno about substance.

Yes, I'm sure of it.  I hadn't thought of using this distinction by
"phenomena" compared to "substance" when speaking of the
non-physical.  This is really helpful to me - thanks.

>...Besant & Leadbeater did that while researching "Occult
>Chemistry"....I've heard that modern scientific findings have
>borne them out.

Do you or anyone else know if these scientific findings have been
recorded and, if so, can you give me a way to find this?  I glanced
at B&L's book sometime ago.  I don't have but can borrow it.  I'll
look at it again.

>When you look at the pictures of auras drawn from Leadbeater's
>descriptions, they're quite different in some of the details from
>the ones drawn from Dora's descriptions.  And yet, I know that
>Leadbeater taught Dora how to interpet more clearly what she
>saw,...

This is what I meant when I said that, so far, I hadn't found the
contributions from people who see non-physical substance very
helpful. (My own included.)  I've participated in more classes,
study groups, seminars, group discussions etc. than I care to
remember where numerous people with this faculty were present.  I'm
sensitive in this way enough to understand what the others are
saying yet all our descriptions of phenomenon happening, even in
the momemt, varying wildly not just widely.  I've done research
that deals with human variability but these observations, for me,
border on random chaos.  I'm sure this is due to some limitation in
me.  But then who has told or will show how these observations fit
into a coherent whole?

>Well, in 1 of the books it mentions that in her younger years the
>clairvoyant worked with a physician, & the clairvoyant diagnosis
>was compared with what was found on the X-rays, or during a
>subsequent operation.

I didn't follow here who is the clairvoyant you mean - Dora?  Also
which book? (I may want to look this up.)

> I've also read of an experiment where a modern yogi was able to
>stop his heart for a while, & the result was confirmed, because he
>was strapped to an electrocardiogram.

Yes, from what I know this is proven and the methods of
bio-feedback grew out of experiments like these.  Bio-feedback, by
the way, is being subjected to the scientific method as we speak.
The very small part of the National Institutes for Health (US) that
is funding research into methods of alternative medicine has funded
some studies.  But seems to me that these experiments show the
ability of the more refined area of people, often the mind, to
control the unrefined area, the physical body.  Still doesn't tell
about the make-up of the refined organism just what it can do.

>I don't know what kind of experiments they're doing at Duke
>University. Do You? Do you know anything about the experiments
>the Russians did, are doing,...

I haven't caught up on the latest with the Duke group but last I
heard they were enmeshed in proving that ESP exists.  I guess a
necessary first step for sceptics.  Yes, I've heard about the
"Russian experiments" but I know of nothing that has been published
and I would love to know what they have written up.  If it's
anything like "straight" research there is a problem getting
translations out of the Russian - ah where are those good old days
of "the one tongue" .....

>I understand some scientists are experimenting in this country as
>well, but they don't very readily admit to it, because it's
>frowned upon.

They are but from what I know they are doing it "under the table"
and it's difficult to find out about.  Few will go to print and
when they do they speak in very broad and blurry generalities.  I
heard a few days ago on public radio about how acupuncture needles
had just received approval from the Food and Drug Administration as
legit medical devices and how this would open up the way to
insurance companies paying for accupuncture procedures.  The report
said now some medical researchers say they want to find out what
*is* this "chi" (in Chinese medicine the subtle energy moved during
acupuncture).  This could be hopeful.  Also reported the biggest
Health Maintenance Organization in California now has an
alternative medicine clinic with an 8 to 10 week waiting list.
I'll bet it is in these clinics that the nut will be cracked - in a
good 20 to 30 years, at least.

>From some of the things my Teacher said, I suppose that etheric
>material is made up of finer & finer vibes.

I had come to this conclusion also and because of this probably the
only way to know about a finer substance is to be "in" a still
finer substance.  People know physical substance with their mental
selves.  That is probably two or more levels apart.  To know about
etheric or astral substance probably have to be in a consciousness
beyond the mental.  Oh well - Patanjali or bust.

Virginia