Theos-Talk Archives (September 1995 Message tl00101)

Greetings:
 Thought I'd pop in w/ my own $.02 worth on the angelic
discussion ... as I've been workin' with them for the better
part of a decade now, and while I rarely try to put the
interactions and experiences into words (mostly because the vast
majority of life on that vibratory band just really can't even be
vaguely reflected through the structures capable of being formed
using the English languge & hence I usually sound like a flaming
idiot when I try (-:). I'll try to mention a few things relevant
to the current discussion & to human growth, though it is my
belief that the large part of their realm has almost *no*
relevance to the human kingdom. I should also preface these
remarks by saying that I do not in any way universalize my
experiences ... and am not making any claims that I am telling
the "truth" about the angelic realm in any absolute sense.
 Nor have I attempted to force the experiences to fit into
any particular conceptual paradigm (such as Theosophy, Kabalism,
etc., etc.). Though I studied a number of such systems when I was
first working with them, and some of the systems seemed to
possess pieces that matched inner experience ... I ultimately
determined that I needed to throw the whole lot out the window
and go at it with no preconceptions ... and see if a paradigm
fluid enough to fit their world could emerge from the world
itself ... that is, I've attempted to do original science in the
most classical sense of the word. Also (in the way of preliminary
remarks), I should say that I have come to greatly dislike the
terms "angel" and "deva" ... as they both carry with them
centuries of connotations, most of which have almost nothing to
do with the "things" I've been working with. I guess I have to
use those words because they are the only ones I've been able to
discover that come anywhere close, but I wish there were
something else to call them .....

 I first "met" them in my early twenties. I was attempting to
bring some sort of discipline to an inner sense, and as such, I
was strolling in Montana wildernesses and just "looking" at the
inner layers of all sorts of forms of life ... plants, animals,
etc., etc. Now and then, at the edge of that vision, I would
catch glimpses of what seemed to be very enormous things of some
sort. Sometimes they were just large waves undulating through the
inner atmosphere, other times they seemed to coil into shapes
like funnels or fountains. It was difficult to focus on these
things (they always seemed kinda blurry, and inexplicably
disturbing to turn attention to for anything more than a few
minutes). They also (unlike everything else I was looking at) had
no presence or appearence in the physical world ... in fact most
seemed to operate entirely oblivious to it.
 After a time, my system got a bit more used to these things
(I was not yet even seeing them as "beings" ... and thought they
might just be the inner analog of weather or something). I began
to see them (or notice them) in the city as well, though they
were harder to see 'cause concentrations of humans ... well,
raise a lot of "dust". Finally, one day in the woods, I
inadvertantly found myself occupying the same space as the point
of one of those "funnels", and caught an enormous sense of
*awareness*, and in trying to understand this (for days
afterwards ...) it finally occurred to me that these things might
be some sort of being, might have some kind of consciousness and
perhaps even possess intentions and purposes. It also occurred to
me that they might be what so many religious traditions called
"angels" (or spirits or demons ... (-:).
 After cookin' this over for awhile, it occured to me to
attempt to find a "channel" to see whether some sort of
communication was possible with them (what can I say ... it was,
after all, the early eighties (-:). It took me well over a year
to find someone suitable.

 [A brief "Channel" interlude: I have had the chance to
observe the inner levels of the phenomena of channelling for a
number of years. Having looked at probably a couple of hundred
people trying to do it, I'd say probably three-quarters are not
doing anything at all. Observing them go into a "trance" (or
whatever they call it) their energy-systems appear to go through
all sorts of odd permutations, sort of *re-arrange* themselves,
and out comes a different "voice". I suspect what is happening in
many cases is that some buried complex, or ego-state that has
fractured off of the main complex of consciousness, or some
bundle of subconscious awareness is simply using the opening to
the surface layer of awareness provided by the person's "trance"
to express itself. In maybe a quarter of the cases, an actual
seperate entity of some sort seemed to be present, and to varying
degrees altering the person's energy system. Two seperate
questions arise at this point: First, how "clearly" is the
channelling. In some cases the vast majority of the person's
energy-system was untouched by the impulses flowing from the
entity ... and at the surface level this would mean that what was
being "channelled" was mostly aspects of the person themself, and
the entity was just sort of causing the person to amplify some
thoughts, supress others, and steer others in some direction. The
other end of this line was when virtually the entire energy
system of the person was affected ... it would change shape and
even change its colors almost entirely. When this happened,
almost everything being "channelled" *was* the impulses of the
entity ... and this means the person's entire energy-system had
become little more than a *translator* ... allowing the entity to
express itself within the frequency band that other humans could
understand .. i.e., human speech. The Second question, after the
the clarity question, has to do with the *nature* of what was
clear or unclear. There seem to be large numbers of living things
in the innerland, with a vast range of relative "wisdom" and
intentions. *Many* people seem to have small things periodically
floating around them, and genuinely wanting to "help", but many
of these things seem to be "partial" consciousnesses ... i.e.,
they look like they might be enormously helpful on a very narrow
range of issues that they know well, partially helpful on others,
and positively useless on others. These may be what people are
now calling "spirit guides". (I've personally never had much use
for such things and usually chase them away ... and believe that
if people have serious questions about their lives, they are
usually likely to get far fuller results by just sitting in a
chair for an hour and bringing the full force of their own reason
to the problem ... but this may just be personal predilection, as
I do know people who have been greatly aided by little spookies).
Out of the couple hundred "channels" in my data set, there are
all of three or four that seemed actually capable of clearly
translating the impulses of the really *huge* energy fields of
the angelic realm ... and a few other beings that are just as
huge but are not angels. I believe that these people were both
born with this as an ability, and each also underwent some form
of very intense discipline and training.]

 ANYway, after finally finding a person, and telling her of
my intentions, we agreed to do some work together, and entered
into nearly a year of weekly (sometimes even daily) discussions
with various members of the "angelic" realm. These discussions
ended when I had configured (with their help) a layer of my own
energy system that permitted me direct discourse without the
necessity of translation into and back out of human language
(which, we discovered, could not help but introduce fairly
substantial distortions into the conversation by its very
nature).
 The first few discussions almost ended the entire project.
Though from everything I could see inwardly the channel was
extremely clear ... and had developed an ethic of her own that
literally filled her with the intention to be precise in her
translation ... a large amount of what the angels were saying
made no sense. I was about to give it up as a hopeless cause (we
were both quite frustrated) when it suddenly occurred to me that
they were making little sense precisely *because* the channel was
so clear ... she was not even distorting the translation through
fundamental human assumptions about the nature of the world, and
the day to day worldview of my consciousness and that of the
angels were simply grounded in utterly different assumptions
about the nature of life and awareness. What then followed were
two significant events in the project ... first, we met a
particular angel that agreed to actually "join" our project, to
work consistently with us (instead of trying to find and connect
with whatever was around), and second, we all agreed that the
first absolute necessity was to attempt to find the "points of
intersection" of our kingdoms ... i.e., to understand at least a
bit about our respective (and for both of us, completely
unquestioned) assumptions about what "reality" was, and to
discover where there was enough of a commonality that meaningful
discussions might be possible.
 As a for instance (and the most superficial one at that), I
had been asking them what I thought was a set of basic questions,
including "What is your purpose?". This question had always
generated a long and hopelessly convoluted answer. After three
months with our "partner", it finally became clear that the
question itself sounded as hopeless and convoluted to the angels
as the answer did to me ... and that in fact not only was the
question not understood, it could not even make any sense even if
it *was* understood .... (this may take a bit of explaining):
 Virtually every one of us, as humans, is born with at least
some form of sensation that surfaces as a sense of "purpose". Few
of us could believe we are just "randomly" here. We can rarely
every fully *conceptualize* that purpose (though now and then we
can articulate the current piece of it we actualizing), but we
cannot help but feel as though we are here for *something*. Many
on the path almost obsessively ask themselves "What is my *true*
purpose ... what *should* I do?" This sensation of "purpose" is
so core to human life that it is virtually unnoticed, and its
almost impossible to imagine what day to day life would feel like
without it. After several months, it finally became clear that
the angelic realm, while most assuredly possessing a form of
self-conscious awareness, had no component of that awareness that
was seperate enough from purpose to be able to ask "What is it?".
When the question "What is your purpose" was translated through
the channel's energy-system, it was perceived by them something
like we would perceive the question "What is your "I"?" ... (and
our answers to that question would prob'ly be more convoluted
than those I got from the angels ...(-:).
 To us, our purpose is something we *do* ... if you are a
"healer", sometimes you are serving patients, but then again
sometimes you are also at a movie. To them, purpose is what they
*are* ... it is an identity question, not a career question (-:).
 Anyway, point is, it took close to nine months of
conversations before there was enough of a common ground for real
discourse to start. It was a *very* disturbing process ... it was
not my ideas that were being questioned, but assumptions buried
to deep that they had never been questioned, and in fact took
substantial work to bring them close enough to the surface to
even render them capable of being questioned ... and it was only
by coming into contact with a realm that did not operate within
them that they even appeared as "assumptions" ... they were
*truths* before I met the angels. The sensation reminded me of
the New Testament story of "walking on water" ... when belief was
strong enough to keep an alternate reality configured the water
was solid, but when belief faltered, it suddenly turned into
*water* and the fellow started sinking ... only in this case it
was not a higher reality dissolving back into human-consensus
reality ... it was consensus reality itself - day to day human
life - that suddenly began periodically turning back into
"water".

[Well, guess this is a long enough post for now ... and is still
only the personal introduction. If the "angelic" thread continues
and there seems to be interest I'll try, in the next post, to
give words to the five or six (IMO) fundamental differences
between the underlying assumptions of our two kingdoms ... which
actually constitute a sort of "angelic cosmology". I *do* hope
this babbling has made some sense ... and perhaps matched some
inner experiences ... of some on the list.]

 Ta ta, and as the angels say, " ."
 -JRC