Theos-Talk Archives (January 1994 Message tl00063)

Jim Meier,

I do not know how to reach you other than through theos-l
just now.

I got your request for a copy of the Cleather's pamphlet
yesterday, and am mailing it just now from my office.
The copy may be somewhat crumpled by the time it reaches
you, but I did the best I could within the constraints
of time and your desire to get it asap for the purpose of
preparation of your talk at the local TS branch. I'll be
interested  in the text of your talk as well, if you can
send it either via mail or otherwise. My phone numbers
are as follows:

Office (M-F 9am - 5 pm) 214 997 0613

Residence               214 867 0101

Fax                     214 669 0154 ( mention Mail Stop L-03)

Please feel free to contact me via phone or otherwise, I look
forward to meeting you on your next visit to D/FW.

Jerry H-E,

I got your wonderful message this morning, which I will reply
in detail later, but I was looking at HPB's Vol XII of Coll. W.
and concluded that her 'astral body' is AAB's
(and indeed Besant/Leadbeater's) Etheric vehicle. I'll check
some more with a couple of books and comment further on this.
One of the most pertinent books for everyone on theos-l (and
one that can be used as a framework for comparison of AAB/HPB
teaching is "Everone is Right' by Roland Peterson published
by De Vorss and Company, POBox 550 Marina del Ray CA 90294.
This book is 'a new look at comparative religion and its relation
to science'. On p. 97, the author has provided a comparison
of terminology regarding the seven planes of the Solar System, as
follows (I am going to omit the column corresponding to Max
Heindel's Rosicrucian model):

Plane        AAB/Besant              HPB

7             Divine (Adi)           Maha Paranirvanic

6             Monadic                Paranirvanic

5             Spiritual(Atmic)       Nirvanic

4             Intuitional (Buddhic)  Buddhic

3             Mental (Manasic)       Manasic

2             Emotional(Astral)      Astral

1             Etheric Physical )      Physical
              Dense Physical   )

As far as bodies are concerned, there is a lengthy description
of them, which I do not have the time to go into at this instant,
but I did  want to mention that according to Bailey, Causal Body
is the vehicle of the 'soul' which resides on the higher mental
planes (subplanes 6 and 5 counting from above); this is shown in
a diagram in several AAB books, including (I think) TCF. Does
HPB talk about a causal body at all?  In my understanding,
Causal Body, Egoic Lotus, soul all three of them refer to the
body of manifestation of the ego (perhaps with slight nuances in
meaning, which I can look up in the blue books if you are
interested). The 'Higher Self' or the 'Spiritual Triad' which
is a vehicle of the Monad on lower planes resides on the Atmic-
Buddhic-Higher Manasic planes; sometimes that is spoken of in AAB
books as the soul as well. The purpose of meditation according
to AAB is to create a 'rainbow bridge' or the Antahkarana, between
the concrete mind and the 'soul' as a first step (this happens
during the first and the second initiation) and between the soul
and the higher manas (Spiritual Triad) as a second step, which
takes place supposedly between the second and the third initiations.

No, I was not aware that Leadbeater and Besant claimed Arhatship
for themselves (if they did, that is a sure sign that they were
not Arhats). According to Benjamine Creme (supposed to be
a psychic), Besant was a 2.0, Leadbeater a 2.4, AAB 3.4,
HPB 4.0 (Arhat) and K also 4.0. A 'psychic' did my initiatory
level study, with a pendulum 3 yrs ago and told me that I
was 1.7 (could be right, who knows). More on this later, if you
are interested in pursuing this line further. My question on the
veracity or otherwise of Leadbeater's Chakras, was just designed
to show that we as aspirants cannot hope to verify whether all
these wise sayings of the wise men of old are right or not, these
must remain as speculations in many cases. Leadbeater's diagram
of Chakras seems to have become a 'standard' one, I have seen
it at too many places lately.

I also want to learn more about your statement that AAB initially
borrowed ES materials. What is your basis for that?  Is the ES
material she borrowed a part of one or several of her books
or is it to be found only in the Arcane School material?  This is
a very serious charge in my opinion, one that I have a hard time
believing in. And is there an Esoteric Section of the various
theosophic groups still in existence (I know TSA has one, but what
about Point Loma etc.)?

Also, when you get a chance, can you write more on the Cleather
pamphlet. Can you send me a copy of the annotated version (that
you were discussing with Nancy the other day)?  Also, are you sending
me a copy of Paul's book as well?  And I could not find your office
telephone number on the statement that you sent me (I do not think
it says 'Invoice' on it). You can feel free to contact me at the
phone numbers given above. BTW, you also need to send me a copy of
that journal on theosophic history with which you are associated
(I had asked for a copy of it before too but never got it).

One last question, have you heard of a pamphlet on 'Senzar' by
John Algeo (available from TSA). I'd like a copy of it as well,
if you can get one.

Got to get back to work now; 'll come back later with more stuff...

/A