Theos-Talk Archives (November 1998 Message tl00177)

<bold><bigger><bigger>Dear Dallas:

I understand what you say. Having seen your msgs, I can assure you that I
have every confidence in you in that you have always presented info that
you know to be correct as far as you know.

As regards the Krotono conference, when issues such as what was said by a
person is in question, the quickest and easiest way to settle would be
for that person, if alive, to respond quickly to clarify. Even if there
was any doubt or ambiguity, it would be very easy to fix it. On the other
hand, if one either does not care to engage in a communication or is
incapable to use the modern technology, then the loser is the person
concerned, not the audience.

mkr

</bigger></bigger></bold>

>From: W. Dallas TenBroeck [mailto:dalval@nwc.net]
>From ???@??? Sun Jan 00 00:00:00 0000
>Date: Tuesday, November 03, 1998 9:23 

Nov. 3rd 1998
Subject: RE: theos-l digest: November 02, 1998

Dallas writes:

Dear MKR:

To offer further clarification.  Please I only make statements

that are based on definite historical documents or first person

witness.  When I don't know I say so.  When I guess or have an

opinion - and I often have many - I also say so, so there is no

mistake.  Also when I find I am wrong I say so right away.

Dal.

Now: --

Concerning the matter of Mr. Judge, and the part that he played

in the T S and its development.

The statements I made are based on Histories and historical

documents.

If Mr. Paul Johnson has something else than opinions (his own or

those of others) to offer, could they be advanced for all to

consider ?  As I read his statements they appear to me inaccurate

and I subjoin comments.

Students who desire to investigate these documents will find them

detailed in two books

THE THEOSOPHICAL MOVEMENT ;  1875 - 1925,  and its sequel

THE THEOSOPHICAL MOVEMENT :  1875 - 1950

The references that are quoted there have all been verified

several times.

1878 - 1896

After HPB and Olcott left for India in 1878 it was Judge who kept

the T S in New York alive by holding weekly meetings, even when

no one was present - as is attested to by others.  Mr.

Neresheimer, is one of those.  Between 1879 and 1886 the work of

the T S apparently faced a recession of interest in the USA -

however it was Judge that kept the thread of continuity alive at

the HQ in New York.

1891 - 1892

Judge produced no "Mahatma letters" that turned Besant against

Olcott.  It was Besant who brought certain opinions of hers to

Judge late in 1891.  (See HISTORIES above. )

Resolutions were passed by the American and the British Sections

T S in 1892 accepting Olcott's resignation (which he wrote

unrequested, alleging health reasons).  Because of Judge's

urging, these Resolutions requested Olcott to rescind his

resignation.  Olcott went on record when he did this, saying that

he had independently received a direct communication from "his

Master" telling him to do so.  This is a matter of Historical

record.

Judge and Vice-Presidency / Presidency  (1891-2)

Judge advised many of his close companions that he was not

interested in leaving New York and America (where his work was).

He was suffering from the incurable Chagres disease, (Back-water

fever) which finally took his life in 1896.  He did not want to

go to Adyar and to assume the Presidency of the T S.

He had been appointed Vice-President T S by Pres. Olcott, and

this was later ratified by the Council in Adyar.  This was during

HPB's life-time.  She stated that this appointment was made at

the "Masters order."  {Documents as above ]

Judge's relations with HPB

It is advisable to consider ALL letters, please.  Then, frame

your own opinion.

1875 -1888

Judge was given a Certificate (14 Dec. 1888) in ES by HPB in 1888

stating he was a "successful chela of 13 years' standing" and was

her "Agent" in America.

More letters giving HPB's opinion of Judge are available in

print.

[ see LETTERS THAT HAVE HELPED ME.  ULT 1931 Centenary Edition,

pp. 276 et seq. ]

Besant's "Co-outer Head E S" termination by Judge

Based on documents.  [ See History ]

1893 - 1894

Besant arrived in Colombo late in 1893, visited Adyar soon after

for the "annual meeting."

Attack on Judge began early in 1894.

"Trial" conducted in mid 1894 in London on flimsy "evidence."

Failed, and "charges" were dismissed.  [ see HISTORY ]

History narrates the sequence of letters and the response for all

to see.

Amity was declared in letters published in LUCIFER, PATH and

THEOSOPHIST.

Attack on Judge was resumed late in 1894.  [ see History ]

Krotona conference:  Statements are made based on my memory (and

notes) of events and words heard.

Dallas