Theos-Talk Archives (April 1996 Message tl00087)

Sitanshu's response is to the point and goes to heart of the issues in
the original message.

As has been repeatedly pointed out by K, every system, every belief,
every religion has not solved human problem. One has just to see what is
going on in the world.

My problem has to be solved by me and not thru any belief or system.

....doss

> Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 09:44:50 -0700
> From: Sitanshu Kumar <kumar@Synopsys.COM>
> Subject: Re: Misunderstandings re: K, ES (fwd)

I dont know why such a big fuss is being raised over some masters
living in the himalayas. It is true that K never denied the existence of
the masters, he simple thought they are largely irrelevant as far as
freedom for mankind is concerned. He has stated that very clearly.
The theosophist seek the masters as spiritual authority, K said
all authority stifles the mind. I think most childish people seek
some kind of miracle, some unknown guiding hand, all that is result
of fear, and fear can not be solved by any authority(look at the
organized religions). It is quite malicious to say that K sought
a special position for himself. His presence was selfless. As far as
Radha Sloss is concerned, she is no more than a fiction writer like
the ones you see on bookstands.( she may have some factual truth,
but her mind seeks sensationalism, very much similar to what
is shown on popular TV shows likes Cops etc.)

sitanshu kumar



> From listening-l-owner@zrz.tu-berlin.de  Tue Apr  9 09:31:41 1996
> Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 11:27:31 -0500 (CDT)
> From: M K Ramadoss <ramadoss@eden.com>
> To: listening-l <listening-l@zrz.tu-berlin.de>
> Subject: Re: Misunderstandings re: K, ES (fwd)
> Mime-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type> : > TEXT/PLAIN> ; > charset=US-ASCII>
> Content-Length: 2999
>
> Here is a response from Paul Johnson, for anyone interested.
> .....doss
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> Date: Tue, 9 Apr 1996 08:22:49 -0500
> From: K. Paul Johnson <pjohnson@leo.vsla.edu>
> To: Multiple recipients of list <theos-l@vnet.net>
> Subject: Re: Misunderstandings re: K, ES
>
> According to M K Ramadoss:
> >
> > This reply is cross-posted to listening-l, where K related matters are
> > discussed. Any respondent on listening-l may like to cross post the
> > message here at  theos-l@vnet.net
>
> Dear Doss:
>
> I really wish you hadn't done that.  With enough adversaries in
> Theosophical circles to last a manvantara, I don't need
> Krishnamurti-ites demanding that I prove everything I say too.
>
> > > so I think it more plausible to conclude that he encouraged her
> > > to maintain the ES and use it as a tool to turn the TS towards
> > > his own teaching.  From what I hear this has been/is being done
> > 	
> > 	This is the first time I hear of this.
>
> If Radha is a disciple or admirer of K., who ran for the
> presidency on his instructions, wouldn't it be surprising if
> that *weren't* reflected in the direction she took the ES?  My
> only source for this is a post someone made in which this was
> asserted as fact here on theos-l.  Of course with people and
> organizations wrapped in secrecy, the chance of an outsider
> being able to prove anything is next to nil.
> >
> > 	After K's statement that Truth is a Pathless Land, I have not
> > seen either his claiming any *authority* for himself least of all any
> > *spiritual* authority,
>
> Sometimes actions speak louder than words.  The best source I
> know of regarding this angle on K. is Sloss's Lives in the
> Shadow.  He certainly allowed-- no, acted as if he expected as
> his proper due-- his followers to treat him with great
> deference due a World Teacher.  While explicitly questioning
> such behavior.
>
>  and I have also not seen his mentioning *Masters*
> > and least of all *his* intimacy with Masters. Since this is a fairly new
> > revelation to me, can you enlighten me about your source for the above.
>
> Actually, on the subject of the Masters, I cannot enlighten
> you on my source since it was made available to me on a
> confidential basis.  However, perhaps I can find some things
> *in that source* which will confirm what I am saying.  Again,
> back to Radha-- if she is really a Krishnamurti intimate and
> disciple, would she be pontificating about the Masters being
> something *beyond perfected men* about whom it is blasphemy to
> speak in human terms, unless she somehow thought such a view in
> harmony with his (secret) teachings?  What I'm suggesting is
> that K. never really denied his intimacy with Masters as
> completely as it might seem from a superficial reading.
> Moreover, he acted as if he were precisely what/whom Leadbeater
> had proclaimed him to be-- the World Teacher.
>
> Will dig around for details.  Feel free to cross post my
> response, since we've gotten started down this path, but I
> don't wish to engage in debates with an expanded group.
>
> Cheers
> P
>