Theos-Talk Archives (September 1995 Message tl00736)

Hi everyone,

Thank you's to Brenda, Stephen, and Rich for your thoughtful responses to my
enquiry. It is obvious that the topic of abortion is emotional, but it also
brings some of our theosophical view into the real world.

Welcome to the list, Stephen.

Stephen suggests that the individual incarnating may have some choice in the
selection of a situation that will speed them on their path toward
fulfillment. Have I paraphrased your comments correctly? If I have, then
one might conclude that the fetus which is aborted actually chose to be
aborted (perhaps in order to rectify some guilt?) I am not sure that I
understand all of the implications of this statement, but it is not unlike
the concept we encounter in medicine with some frequency where individuals
are self destructive in their behaviors. One can also look at the idea of
choice, and see that the individual has a choice to enter into a more loving
situation, where the infant is wanted. (recall the earlier post, sorry I
don't know who said it, why didn't you choose Bill and Hillary as
parents?...,cause I'm a republican.)

Rich suggests that abortion is murder. I believe that in the Gita, Arjuna
balks before battle because he realizes he is about to murder his opponents.
 Krishna teaches then of duty. Brenda suggests that I might want to know
what theosophists think about war as well, and I would. I, for one, do not
see any difference in the act of killing by abortion, the act of killing by
murder, and the act of killing by war. I do, however, think there may be
some differences in the moral position of the warrior, the murderer, and the
abortionist. Does theosophy speak to this difference?

Brenda suggests that family planning might be an alternative to warfare.
 Interesting concept. Actually, family planning is not the sole domain of
females, as men can be part of the process, and should be, in my opinion.

Brenda suggests that balancing all the karma in one's life may liberate one
from rebirth. As I understand karma, it may be viewed within the ideas of
cause and effect. Abortion, for the fetus, may be the effect of an act in a
past life. The abortionist may only be the agent, again acting out his own
personal path. Thus, perhaps the fetus needs to die in order to continue its
path, ultimately learning or gaining from the abbreviated physical existence,
and approaching liberation from rebirth sooner.

I am not familiar with dePurucker, however the idea suggested by Brenda from
that source would seem to go against the the idea suggested by Rich from HPB
that the soul does not settle into a body until later in life. I am inclined
to reconcile these two opposing comments by thinking in terms of CWL's view
of the relation between the physical, astral, mental, and causual bodies. I
am inclined to think in terms of potential expression of the higher levels,
which is dependant on experience in life, education, and enlightenment. The
fetus has the potential, but until the potential is watered, fed, and
groomed, the potential is unexpressed. I look forward to hearing all your
opinions on this cental theme in theosophy which arises as we consider the
mundane issue of abortion.

I was surprised no one has raised another point of view which we have all
neglected. What of the effects of abortion on the life of the mother-to-be?
 The issue is very complex. If, as HPB is quoted to say, abortion is a
crime, who is the criminal? Who is the victim? Is the abortionist to be
seen as a villan or as a servant? Rich suggests that we are responsible for
our own actions, that we cannot exercise our dharma with the thought that the
karma of another makes us do the act. I would ask, is there a greater plan
which balances the lives of all men through the synergistic interaction of
individuals, so that one man's dharma supports anothers karma?

Throughout all of the comments in response to my enquiry so far, I sense
another issue. It seems we are judging the act of abortion by some moral
standard. perhaps, here, we see a way to investigate one of my earlier
comments. Is there a difference between the act of killing in war, the act
of murder, and the act of abortion at some moral level? If so, what is the
moral standard? Do we, as individuals, have the right to judge?

Liesel has given us an important hint in his post today. I believe we should
all keep it in mind: Don't believe anything. if you come across something
you like, it's a theory. Ask why, why, why...

So I ask, Why? Why do men kill their fellow men? (be it abortion, murder,
or warfare?)

The conflict I see within the ideas of Karma, Dharma, and Reincarnation seems
clear to me. There is enough misunderstanding of the terms, that they may be
tied together, as we have within this discussion, and used to justify actions
in the physical life which seem to be repugnant, and opposed to the idea of
the pursuit of the welfare of all mankind. I thank you all for your input
into this discussion, and I hope there will be more, as I think we all can
learn from the studied discussion of the application of our fundamental
philosophical concepts to our mundane world.

Love and light, Fred