Theos-Talk Archives (August 1993 Message tl00018)

Hmmm..  alot of discussion here. all quite good too.

Concerning QM...
The recent issue of Physics Today had a good article on how classical
Chaos can simulate the solutions of the QM wave equations.  However,
they also point out that some QM phenomena *cannot* be described by
this (semi-classical) approach.  Basically any QM effect which totally
contradicts a classical physical event will NOT occur through this
semi-classical approach.  Some key examples are QM tunnelling and self
interference.

I might also mention the recent issue of Scientific American (next to
recent issue now, I think) which has some very persuasive experimental
evidence supporting the QM "Philosophy" versus a deterministic (hidden
variable) theory.  This is VERY hard to ignore and get
aro
anyone wants :-) ).  I (also) have had the "Life" event (or two) which
defy the reason of a totally deterministic Karmic Law.  (Helms Happens)
(a NC joke!)

Perhaps another compromise (i.e. idea) is in order..

1) QM is a deterministic theory, but it only determines the Wave
function *exactly* (side-stepping measurement interpretation).

2) The "real" object, which is so precisely "determined" by QM, is
unobservable (the wavefunction).  .....(nice "out" huh?)

3) The "observable" events conform to classic physics.  i.e.  particles
are observed caught IN potential wells; or observed "outside" potential
wells (energy conservation is *observed*, not violated).  reality does
it's QM-only events (e.g.Tunnelling) only where it is "virtual" (not
physically observed!).  (we don't observe partially cancelled particles
either)

4) The *deterministic* "Reality" of QM is an existance only in the
mental plane (where the Wave function exists).  Hence, the mind(s)
*should* be able to affect it (and observe it) there.  In fact the
global consciousness can/should be able to interact with it.  This can
explain the separation/appearance of personal and social/society Karma
(i.e.  getting clobbered by an "unpredictable" Life-event).

The idea is that we have a deterministic (when viewing ALL levels of
existence simultaneously) theory whicha allows for a purely statistical
QM "Philosophy" (i.e.  non-deterministic) when dealing with the
"Physical" world.

I assume an enlightened individual (totally aware and active at all
levels/planes) could live a life *free* from the "random" (i.e.
societal and/or "unpredictable") Karmic events.

Gee...  I think I just straddled everyone's position (well, only in a
limited fashion).

The question is whether Bell's theorem (which has "proven" that QM is
"Physically-Correct" i.e.  PC) can allow for this deterministic
approach on the higher plans.  I think the answer is yes.?? comments??

Peace --

John Mead

p.s. I think when people are referring to "Scientists" as a group,
that they are using the word in a limited fashion to represent the
Atheist/MaterialWorld-Only thinking that is (relatively often) seen in
that group.  Being a Scientist (or misfit of science), I too grump
more than I should about that type of "closed" thinking.  But then,
I spend ALOT of time around those people and need the stress release
to cope on a daily basis!!!