Theos-Talk Archives (January 1997 Message tl00129)

On Tue, 7 Jan 97, liesel@dreamscape.com (liesel f. deutsch) wrote:

>Tom Robertson wrote:

>>Jesus said, "you have heard that it was said by them of old, 'an eye for an
>>eye, and a tooth for a tooth.'  But I say to you, 'love your enemies.'"
>>Did he mean to do away with justice and replace it with love, or might he
>>have meant to balance the two?  Shouldn't love for others be balanced >>with standing up for one's own rights, or is it never right to be selfish in
>>that way?  If love should rule over justice, does that mean that we should
>>let others take advantage of us and trust that justice is inevitable?
>>Isn't revenge based on the quest for justice, and yet isn't it also the
>>antithesis of love?  Does forgiveness mean being a doormat?>

>You come up with the darndest ideas, Tom. 

Thank you!


>I would give as an example that a teenager might get into
>trouble with the law out of sheer boredom, not having anything to do, not
>having family which gives a hoot. I would put a kid like that in a situation
>which would try to make up for the lacks in his life. I'd do it behind bars,
>if that's what the situatiion called for, but I'd give him something else to
>think about, like a ged, or a trade with which he could make a living, or
>help his imagination so he'll do more constructive things with his leisure
>time. 

HPB said that 85% of life is dictated to us, from which I infer that she
did not consider individual responsibility to be the whole story of a human
life.  The influences on youth that shape their lives was probably
uppermost in her mind at the time.


>I think it's perfectly ok to be selfish in that you need to stand up for
>your own rights. I've found that usually what's best for one party, is also
>good for the other. like if you're dealing with a bully, you put your foot
>down. I don't believe in someone being totally unselfish. It's ok to be the
>one to give in at times, but being a doormat isn't healthy, I don't think.
>Sometimes you have to inist on having things your way.

Balance is the ideal.  Kant's idea of putting duty first may be the best
guide, since it includes both self-interest and the interests of others.


>As for forgiveness meaning that you'll be a doormat, I like to go by Martin
>Luther King's non-violent dictum "Hate the deed, but love the doer". 

It amazes me that some people think they have to choose between evaluation
and tolerance.  People take the words of Jesus saying not to judge as
meaning that the behavior of others should not be evaluated.  Others
consider intolerance to be a virtue on the grounds that good should be
valued over evil.  I see no reason why both are not possible.  Distinctions
should be made in evaluating good and evil, but conditional compassion is
non-existent compassion.


>One of
>my teachers, Serge King, taught us that if you're unforgiving, the
>resentment festers inside you , and keeps you from feeling good. With that
>in mind, I try my darndest to forgive. 

In my Christian days, I went to the same seminar once or twice a year.  One
thing the teacher said was that bitterness, by focusing so much on a
certain behavior, causes the one who is bitter to conform to that behavior.