Theos-Talk Archives (June 1995 Message tl00128)

Greetings:

Just received Daniel's post ...  what a wonderful piece of humor
for this 4th of July weekend! I don't think I've ever seen
someone attempt to guilt-trip an entire list before.
YeeeeHaaaaa!

Since I am a proud member of the "clique" referred to, I thought
I'd venture an answer as humorous as the original post (-:).

>Now I think I understand what they mean by "clique" mentality.
>Do I sense a kind of "censorship"?

Yes! Of course! A whole bunch of us privately e-mailed one
another furiously for several days, understanding how deeply the
critique of PJ's book would affect the TS, and indeed western
civilization as a whole, and we decided to cleverly and
seperately drop flame after flame into your mailbox.  But you
discovered us and exposed us! Alright! We admit it! We want to
censor you! We want to make sure no one hears your ideas!

>Yes, I will post part II of my critique on Paul Johnson's books
>on Theos-Roots so as to pacify those members of Theos-l who find
>such postings "boring", etc., etc.

I myself don't need to be "pacified", and yes, *I* am one of
those that find such things *boring* ...  and even further,
*thought* I understood that theos-roots was *specifically
created* because of the understanding that Theosophical history
is a distinct area that those on theos-l may not necessarily wish
to explore.  Instead of doing it to "pacify" people, why not
instead do it because that's where it belongs in the first place,
and you *respect* the *choice* of those who wish to belong to
theos-l but not theos-roots.

>I actually believe I would learn something new, and you might
>learn something new, and other interested parties on THEOS-ROOTS
.(please note this specific forum, oh sensitive readers) might
>learn something new (isn't that part of what education is all
>about?).
>I now bow to that vocal minority on Theos-l and will confine my
>P.J. remarks in the future to Theos-roots.  I hope that in the
>future I do not rouse the fury of the crowd in any other remarks
>I may make on any other taboo or boring or irrelevant or ?
>subject.

Zippy da doo dah! How lovely that you would choose to utterly
demean those who simply said "We *don't* want to hear it and if
you wish to say it, would you please say it on the list where it
belongs".  If someone was in a university course called "Trends
in Modern Playwriting", and someone stood up in the back of the
room and launched an intense critique of some new work that made
fresh propositions concerning who `really' wrote Sheakspeare's
plays, would it be "censorship" for the professor to say, simply,
"This isn't the class for that topic" ...  would the other
students be overly "sensitive" if they suggested the student take
a Sheakspeare seminar if he wished to discuss his pet topic?

You hope you don't rouse the "fury of the crowd"? Good grief,
who's the martyr now? Do you actually think all those flames came
because you are addressing a subject that is "taboo"? You are
bowing to a "vocal minority"? From all the posts I've seen on
theos-l since your Part I, 'tis *you* that are the "vocal
minority" ...  do ya think maybe, just maybe, that a majority,
perhaps a large majority, of the theos-l members have not even
*read* Paul's book ...  and hence have little interest (and very
likely could not even follow) a critique of the thing?

>Right of liberty of thought and of expression thereof?.....with
>exceptions of course!
>But mind your P's and Q's, also no CAPS, no ! points, no
>"stuff"......Such a free and open theos network!  [I said no
>exclamation points!]

Yes! As previously admitted, there is a *conspiracy*! Everyone
talked and decided that *you* shouldn't have the "right" of
thought and expression ...  *You* are the exception, because of
the content of the subject matter! Theosophists are, of course,
*known* for moving in herds ...  known for *always* thinking
alike ..  and your ideas are *so startling* that we are all now
*afraid* of the truths they contain ...  and hence, out of
terrible intellectual fear of having our minds opened, we beg you
please, please move your comments to theos-r ...  so we can
remain content in our dim, truthless worlds!

Seriously though, perhaps you received some personal posts I am
unaware of, but all I saw on the list was the question "does
theos-l wish to discuss this", and a fairly complete consensus
that simply said "no".  This is not a limitation of any "right"
to thought and expression, but is the way almost all of the lists
I'm on, scientific, cultural, religious and philosophical, arrive
at the group decision to either take up a subject or to choose
not to.  And on those occaisions when a person forces a topic
that the list consensus has decided against (and often the
decision is made because the topic just isn't felt to be within
the parameters of the list) ...  it either forces the moderator
to switch from unmoderated to moderated and temporarily screen
all posts (which just happened on another list I belong to) or it
causes people to begin signing off the list.

Both the greatest blessing and the greatest curse of the wild
frontier of cyberspace is that there actually *is* almost
complete freedom of thought and expression ...  a blessing
because (for instance) it gives those of us here the chance to
carry on drawn out discussions with Theosophists and interested
parites that span several continents and all the different
theosophical institutions (this list may be more purely theosophy
than any of the individual organizations are) ...  but a curse
because that very freedom, if not used responsibly, gives one
single individual the ability to ruin lists (and I've seen entire
lists almost collapsed by one or two people).

I am happy you have chosen to simply bow to what seems to clearly
be the list consensus, but was it really necessary to launch this
passive- agressive attack on those who requested you do so? Might
you not actually concede that theos-r *is* really where the
discussion belongs ...  and move the discussion there willingly
instead of with a self-righteous snarl?

Peace, Chuckles & a happy 4th! -JRC